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	<title>Comments on: From JSON to RDF in Six Easy Steps with JRON</title>
	<atom:link href="http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/</link>
	<description>Knock Down Walled-Garden Walls</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Alex</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-526</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Alex]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 22 Apr 2011 20:29:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-526</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;2: Allow Language Tags...Personally, I’ve never liked this bit of RDF&quot;

I sympathize with your distaste. Languages and datatype could have been predicates of the named tuple or object, which would have given languages more flexibility in different domains, including more properties on the languages themselves.

On the other hand, the language tag drastically reduces ambiguity and processing cost in a collaborative multi-lingual dictionary. But that&#039;s a datastore implementation detail, not something that should be encoded in the abstract or serialization formats.

JSON Triple Sets flattens the triple (octuple?) with s, p, o, s_type, p_type, o_type, o_datatype, o_lang. This could be implemented with a consistent hierarchy:

{s_value, s_type,
 p_value, p_type,
 o_value, o_type, o_datatype, o_lang}

or

{ s_value,
  s_type,
  p : [{ p_value,
         p_type,
         o : [{ o_value,
                o_type,
                o_datatype,
                o_lang,
             }]
      }]
}]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;2: Allow Language Tags&#8230;Personally, I’ve never liked this bit of RDF&#8221;</p>
<p>I sympathize with your distaste. Languages and datatype could have been predicates of the named tuple or object, which would have given languages more flexibility in different domains, including more properties on the languages themselves.</p>
<p>On the other hand, the language tag drastically reduces ambiguity and processing cost in a collaborative multi-lingual dictionary. But that&#8217;s a datastore implementation detail, not something that should be encoded in the abstract or serialization formats.</p>
<p>JSON Triple Sets flattens the triple (octuple?) with s, p, o, s_type, p_type, o_type, o_datatype, o_lang. This could be implemented with a consistent hierarchy:</p>
<p>{s_value, s_type,<br />
 p_value, p_type,<br />
 o_value, o_type, o_datatype, o_lang}</p>
<p>or</p>
<p>{ s_value,<br />
  s_type,<br />
  p : [{ p_value,<br />
         p_type,<br />
         o : [{ o_value,<br />
                o_type,<br />
                o_datatype,<br />
                o_lang,<br />
             }]<br />
      }]<br />
}</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: RDF Steps Carefully Forward &#171; Decentralyze &#8211; Programming the Data Cloud</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-512</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[RDF Steps Carefully Forward &#171; Decentralyze &#8211; Programming the Data Cloud]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Apr 2011 00:53:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-512</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] for a JSON serialization that appeals to non-RDF-folks. This was something I was interested in (cf JRON) but I agree there&#8217;s too much design work to do in a Working Group like this. The door was [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] for a JSON serialization that appeals to non-RDF-folks. This was something I was interested in (cf JRON) but I agree there&#8217;s too much design work to do in a Working Group like this. The door was [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Simplified RDF &#171; Decentralyze &#8211; Programming the Data Cloud</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-397</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Simplified RDF &#171; Decentralyze &#8211; Programming the Data Cloud]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Nov 2010 18:24:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-397</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] also think simplified RDF will play well with JSON developers. JRON is pretty simple, but simplified RDF would allow it to be simpler still. Or, rather, it would mean [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] also think simplified RDF will play well with JSON developers. JRON is pretty simple, but simplified RDF would allow it to be simpler still. Or, rather, it would mean [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Graham Klyne</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-318</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Graham Klyne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 16:06:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-318</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m pretty much done with with my JRON implementation for now: notes at http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/source/browse/trunk/docs/JRON-for-rdfquery-implementation-notes.txt

This implementation is coded in Javascript as a jQuery plugin that works with the rdfquery library.  It converts data between JRON object structures and rdfquery databank objects.

Currently, part of the Shuffl project (http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m pretty much done with with my JRON implementation for now: notes at <a href="http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/source/browse/trunk/docs/JRON-for-rdfquery-implementation-notes.txt" rel="nofollow">http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/source/browse/trunk/docs/JRON-for-rdfquery-implementation-notes.txt</a></p>
<p>This implementation is coded in Javascript as a jQuery plugin that works with the rdfquery library.  It converts data between JRON object structures and rdfquery databank objects.</p>
<p>Currently, part of the Shuffl project (<a href="http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/" rel="nofollow">http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/</a>).</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Graham Klyne</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-317</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Graham Klyne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Jul 2010 11:44:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-317</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree using a plain JS array is unattractive.  If only because it leaves nowhere to easily hang the prefixes.

As for the use-case - you may be right, but if trying to round-trip between JSON and &quot;real&quot; RDF, then some way of handling multiple statements is needed (currently, my code dies if asked to serialize statements with multiple subjects to JRON).  So maybe it doesn&#039;t matter if its less pretty, as long as it&#039;s possible.

Rather than using __values here, maybe use something like __statements?  Not sure if that helps or hinders.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree using a plain JS array is unattractive.  If only because it leaves nowhere to easily hang the prefixes.</p>
<p>As for the use-case &#8211; you may be right, but if trying to round-trip between JSON and &#8220;real&#8221; RDF, then some way of handling multiple statements is needed (currently, my code dies if asked to serialize statements with multiple subjects to JRON).  So maybe it doesn&#8217;t matter if its less pretty, as long as it&#8217;s possible.</p>
<p>Rather than using __values here, maybe use something like __statements?  Not sure if that helps or hinders.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: sandhawke</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-315</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[sandhawke]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 18:38:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-315</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I like the idea of the whole expression representing a value, so the whole thing is recursive.  So following that idea, we can&#039;t use a plan JS array.  What we can do is use the multivalue structure.  So we get:

{ &quot;__values&quot;: [
     { &#039;foaf.name&#039;: &#039;Sandro Hawke&#039;,
       &#039;__node_id&#039;: &#039;n334&#039; },
     { &#039;foaf.name&#039;: &#039;Eric Prud’hommeaux&#039;,
       &#039;__node_id&#039;: &#039;n102&#039; } ],
  &quot;__prefixes&quot;: {
         &quot;foaf.&quot; : &quot;http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/&quot;
}

I can&#039;t quite decide if that&#039;s too confusing.   I&#039;m also not sure how common this case is; I think the typical JSON user is used to always having a JSON expression be one object, so they wouldn&#039;t think to want this.   For them sending one object or one array is fine (and more can be nested if necessary.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I like the idea of the whole expression representing a value, so the whole thing is recursive.  So following that idea, we can&#8217;t use a plan JS array.  What we can do is use the multivalue structure.  So we get:</p>
<p>{ &#8220;__values&#8221;: [<br />
     { 'foaf.name': 'Sandro Hawke',<br />
       '__node_id': 'n334' },<br />
     { 'foaf.name': 'Eric Prud’hommeaux',<br />
       '__node_id': 'n102' } ],<br />
  &#8220;__prefixes&#8221;: {<br />
         &#8220;foaf.&#8221; : &#8220;http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/&#8221;<br />
}</p>
<p>I can&#8217;t quite decide if that&#8217;s too confusing.   I&#8217;m also not sure how common this case is; I think the typical JSON user is used to always having a JSON expression be one object, so they wouldn&#8217;t think to want this.   For them sending one object or one array is fine (and more can be nested if necessary.)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Graham Klyne</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-308</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Graham Klyne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jul 2010 11:01:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-308</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The RDF/XML example was stripped out of my last comment.  Trying again:

How to represent this:


&lt;?xml version=&quot;1.0&quot;?&gt;
&lt;rdf:RDF 
    xmlns:rdf=&quot;http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#&quot;
    xmlns:foaf=&quot;http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/&quot;
&gt;
   &lt;rdf:Description rdf:nodeID=&quot;n334&quot;&gt;
     &lt;foaf:name&gt;Sandro Hawke&lt;/foaf:name&gt;
   &lt;/rdf:Description&gt;
   &lt;rdf:Description rdf:nodeID=&quot;n102&quot;&gt;
     &lt;foaf:name&gt;Eric Prud&#039;hommeaux&lt;/foaf:name&gt;
   &lt;/rdf:Description&gt;
&lt;/rdf:RDF&gt;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The RDF/XML example was stripped out of my last comment.  Trying again:</p>
<p>How to represent this:</p>
<p>&lt;?xml version=&#8221;1.0&#8243;?&gt;<br />
&lt;rdf:RDF<br />
    xmlns:rdf=&#8221;http://www.w3.org/1999/02/22-rdf-syntax-ns#&#8221;<br />
    xmlns:foaf=&#8221;http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/&#8221;<br />
&gt;<br />
   &lt;rdf:Description rdf:nodeID=&#8221;n334&#8243;&gt;<br />
     &lt;foaf:name&gt;Sandro Hawke&lt;/foaf:name&gt;<br />
   &lt;/rdf:Description&gt;<br />
   &lt;rdf:Description rdf:nodeID=&#8221;n102&#8243;&gt;<br />
     &lt;foaf:name&gt;Eric Prud&#8217;hommeaux&lt;/foaf:name&gt;<br />
   &lt;/rdf:Description&gt;<br />
&lt;/rdf:RDF&gt;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Graham Klyne</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-307</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Graham Klyne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jul 2010 10:59:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-307</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What do you propose as the &quot;top-level&quot; JRON structure?

On first reading, I assumed it would be an object, corresponding to a single RDF subject.  But that doesn&#039;t allow multiple statements about different subjects, such as would typically appear within an  element.

A logical alternative would be an javascript array, which would need to be treated differently to property arrays which you have described - but I don&#039;t see that&#039;s particularly problematic.

Reducing it to a test case, how to represent this?:



   
     Sandro Hawke
   
   
     Eric Prud&#039;hommeaux
   
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What do you propose as the &#8220;top-level&#8221; JRON structure?</p>
<p>On first reading, I assumed it would be an object, corresponding to a single RDF subject.  But that doesn&#8217;t allow multiple statements about different subjects, such as would typically appear within an  element.</p>
<p>A logical alternative would be an javascript array, which would need to be treated differently to property arrays which you have described &#8211; but I don&#8217;t see that&#8217;s particularly problematic.</p>
<p>Reducing it to a test case, how to represent this?:</p>
<p>     Sandro Hawke</p>
<p>     Eric Prud&#8217;hommeaux</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Graham Klyne</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-306</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Graham Klyne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jul 2010 15:29:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-306</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[FYI: I&#039;m looking at doing a Javascript implementation of this for use with RDFQuery.  My initial notes and test cases are here: http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/wiki/JRON_implementation_notes.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>FYI: I&#8217;m looking at doing a Javascript implementation of this for use with RDFQuery.  My initial notes and test cases are here: <a href="http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/wiki/JRON_implementation_notes" rel="nofollow">http://code.google.com/p/shuffl/wiki/JRON_implementation_notes</a>.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Graham Klyne</title>
		<link>http://decentralyze.com/2010/06/04/from-json-to-rdf-in-six-easy-steps-with-jron/#comment-300</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Graham Klyne]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Jun 2010 06:28:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://decentralyze.com/?p=174#comment-300</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sandro, my last comment - I missed the bit you said about parallelProperty semantics.  But I&#039;m not entirely convinced that&#039;s enough.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sandro, my last comment &#8211; I missed the bit you said about parallelProperty semantics.  But I&#8217;m not entirely convinced that&#8217;s enough.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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